Sunday, 19 February 2012

Calling A Malignant Narcissist On Their Crap

I found this definition of malignant narcissism on Wikipedia and it sums-up the MN quite well.    
Malignant narcissism has been described as "an extreme form of antisocial personality disorder that is manifest in a person who is pathologically grandiose, lacking in conscience and behavioral regulation, and with characteristic demonstrations of joyful cruelty and sadism.”
Cruelty can be described as indifference to suffering, and even positive pleasure in inflicting it. If this habit is supported by a legal or social framework, then it receives the name of perversion.  
Cruel ways of inflicting suffering may involve violence, but affirmative violence is not necessary for an act to be cruel.  For example, if a person is drowning and begging for help, and another person is able to help, but merely watches with disinterest or perhaps mischievous amusement, that person is being cruel rather than violent.
·         Pathologically grandiose
·         Demonstrations of joyful cruelty
·         Mischievous amusement and positive pleasure at another’s pain and suffering
·         Callous indifference to another’s need for help, care, attention etc.
Malignant narcissist is thy name, and they are all big time perverts. Now a person doesn’t need to be drowning in water to be at the receiving end of the MN’s cruelty. I see that example as a kind of a metaphor for basic mental, emotional, psychological and physical needs that the malignant narcissist not only refuses to meet, but actually gets off on depriving you of, AND finds further perverse pleasure in the devastating effect the deprivation has on you.  While you are drowning in the water, they’ll jump in and push your head down. Or, they’ll look on with glee while you flay around and exhaust yourself trying to stay above the surface. However, soon the malignant narcissist will get bored and resentful with all the attention the fight for your life has sucked-out of poor little old them. So by the time you start to sink, they’ll yawn and watch with disinterest. Actually, they’ve probably already abandoned you with smug satisfaction by the time you start to sink. Do you think these freaks make safe parents, siblings, friends, relatives or neighbors?       
Hey, it’s not enough that these sickos watch with mischievous amusement while you are under severe emotional distress, physical pain, and psychological trauma to the point where you are so disoriented that you can’t help yourself.  The malignant narcissist also gets frustrated and angry that you had the nerve to inconvenience them with your need for help and attention. So they walk out the door in a huff, leaving you to fend for yourself. Your distress is entertaining for only so long. So you call a cab and make it to emergency and end up in the hospital for a few days, and when you are out of the hospital the MN who abandoned you in your time of need, ever so bitter that you saved yourself and survived, leaves you a cruel phone message where he mocks you and calls you a “wacko.” And the malignant narcissist sister who caused the additional trauma that landed you in the hospital screams at you, “Have you hit rock bottom?!!”  
That one is for you Clancy, you toxic sack of MN shit! And that one is for you sis, you malignant narcissist freak! And that one is for you MN Oldies 69, you sick perverted old janitors. FYI: the only reason I don’t use the MN’s first AND last name is NOT to protect the guilty, but to protect myself. I don’t give a shit about the Malignant Narcissist. I really don’t. I’m here to expose them for the criminals they are. If I didn’t hate lawyers so much I would sue all their asses.   
So you want to call a vile MN pervert on their crap? Well, let me re-cap things. Again, this came out of the mouth of malignant narcissist sister while she was screaming at me over the phone for having the nerve to succumb to abuse and trauma.  In my own way, I begged her for mercy by saying, “Don’t talk to me like that. You’re not in control of me.” The malignant narcissist’s infamous response was and I quote:
“Why do you expect ME to act a certain way?!!! Why can’t YOU just be complaisant?!!”
(For a run-down on this story go HERE )
Malignant narcissists are PATHLOGICALLY GRANDIOSE and that means: they are perfect in every way, they can do no wrong, they’re above reproach, and so superior to us mere mortals. They are high, high above and we are way down below. As lowly peons, we exist to please the narcissist. We have no rights at all. Never mind the right to need any help, attention, or vital care, let alone question their despicable behavior. For the grandiose malignant narcissist sadist, ever so lacking in conscience and behavioural regulations, is ENTITLED to neglect you, deny you, dismiss you, ignore you, blame you, abandon you, humiliate you, slander you, judge you, criticize you, belittle you, denigrate you, control you, manipulate you, mentally bludgeon you, toy with you, harass you, attack you, stalk you, beat you and generally treat you like dirt and destroy you. It’s their right you see, because you are nothing but an object to be used for the narcissist’s own gratification. And “objects” don’t have the right to think, feel, need or even be.  If you are in a relationshit with a narcissist, you really should know your place. And please, please don’t complain. You really have no right to do so.

Malignant narcissists are NOT normal. They have never been normal, and they will never be normal. They are inhumane, period. So if you want to relate to them as a NORMAL human being then good luck to you. The only value you have is how you can aggrandize the narcissist and more often than not that involves hurting you in some way: they crush you to vaunt themselves. So the vile MN crap machine doesn’t want to hear about how they hurt you because hurting you in their sick minds is not only their right, but their intended goal, and they feel entitled to obtain their goal without receiving any flack. No one questions the behaviour of The Mighty Malignant Demi-God, no matter how heinous their crimes. For despite hard evidence to the contrary, the narcissist perceives themselves to be perfect and right by virtue of who they THINK they are.  And remember: the narcissist’s thinking is all lies. They’ve been tinkering with reality since inception so their minds are warped and twisted to the point of delusions. Don’t try and reason with the insane.    
Trying to reason with a narcissist and explain to them how they hurt you is as futile as trying to explain quantum physics to the cast of Jersey Shore. The best you’ll get, and this is the BEST you’ll get, is the narcissist trying to “fake” some semblance of understanding. It might look something like this: the narcissist’s eyes will glaze over; they’ll look at you with a dead stare, nod their big fat pointy heads and mutter such things as, “Duh. Umm. Okay. Yeah. I can see how you think that seemed this or that.” AND, if you listen real close there will be a BUT that justifies their crimes and excludes them from responsibility, for the narcissist is NEVER in the wrong. So do they actually get it? No! Not one bit. In fact, when the narcissist “fakes” understanding and “temporarily” adjusts their behaviour, often by over-the-top and smarmy displays of gratitude or flattery - BEWARE. At this point, they’re simply afraid of being abandoned by their host, and all narcissists need hosts to parasitize. The narcissist will do whatever it takes to keep their punching bag around. So you can expect some phony and very brief adjustments, but the narcissist will revert to default position in no time.   
So please don’t be a sucker for the Rat Game. The narcissist is delivering to you – the rat – a tasty treat. Treats may pop out with the first few pushes of the button, but eventually the treat will be replaced by an electric shock. And that’s the narcissist’s true nature. So don’t bother pushing the button again, and again, and again in anticipation of a treat… unless of course, you enjoy pain.
The Rat Game is how the narcissist tries to keep their victims off-balance. You say to yourself, “But, they can be nice sometimes.” No – they – can’t! Narcissists can behave “normal” sometimes when they’re wearing the mask and when it’s in THEIR best interest to do so, but they are never genuinely nice, compassionate, caring or loving because they’re missing the old empathy chip and a conscience. Narcissists aren’t like you and me. They are heartless factory assembled MACHINES. You’ve met one narcissist, you’ve met them all.
How many of us ACoNs desperately clung to those few “normal” moments with an N parent(s)? Those fleeting “normal” moments were considered “The Good Times” in an N family. So like the rats that got the first tasty treat, children of narcissists HUNGER for another tasty treat and keep pushing and pushing that button in hope that they will deliver us a crumb like they did last week, or last month, or five years ago. THAT is narcissistic abuse. And that’s the best you’ll get with a narcissist: the occasional crumb. You deserve better.
As an ACoN, I was brainwashed and trained into believing, by MN parents and MN sibling, that I had no rights. No rights at all. No right to defend myself. No right to fight back. I wasn’t allowed to think or feel. In fact, thinking and feeling and trying to protect myself was EXTREMELY dangerous. You put up, and shut-up in an N family or suffer the consequences for your NORMAL human behaviour, feelings, emotions and reactions. You’re not allowed to BE in an N family, let alone protect and defend your BEING. So you end up getting the shit beaten out of you emotionally, psychologically and physically and you carry the shame of the abuse through-out your life. BUT you never had a choice. You were doing what you needed to do to survive, you were taking the abuse.
Maybe when you were young you cried and screamed (you had a normal reaction) when they hit you. But the N parent raged, “You shut-up! Or, I’ll let you have it again!” Maybe you got angry when they humiliated you, or you told them that they hurt your feelings. The N snapped, “Grow-up!” “You’re too sensitive!” Or, they got that evil glint in their eyes, and that smirk crossed their face and they mocked you.  You knew right there and then they loved your pain. So you learned the safest reaction to the abuse was no reaction. Don’t give them the satisfaction.
And what if you did react in full-force by defending yourself and fighting back against the MN bullies by giving them a taste of their own medicine? What then? Well, rest assured you wouldn’t hear the end of it. You see, the narcissist is entitled to behave like a pig and abuse you for a life time, but if you dare to call them on their crap ONCE in that life time they will bitch and moan and complain, and whine and play the hard done by martyr over how mean you were to THEM that one time when you decided not to play by their sick rules and exercised your right to self-preservation. A relationshit with a narc is like this: they get to abuse you, and you get to take-it. Whether it’s subtle N abuse or flat-out vicious MN cruelty, thems the rules.   

Another thing that happens when the N target, or MN family whipping pole/scapegoat rebels is they are labelled the one with all the problems, AND the identified patient.
The N cult can’t tolerate such disobedience so they re-group, have a conference, and pathologize and slander you to anyone who is stupid enough to listen. They go for the jugular by feigning creepy concern. I say “concern” is creepy because it’s a derogatory term. It’s another way of saying, “I’m flawless, wonderful and such a compassionate person, but there’s something wrong with you.” That shit only comes out of the mouths of Ns who are knee deep in it and trying to mess with you or assassinate your character. “I really don’t know why he/she is angry all the time.” “He/she has problems.” “I do my best, but she/he is so disturbed.” “Perhaps, he/she is mentally ill?” And the narcissist projection machine rages on. “I’m very concerned.”  Yeah right, “concerned.” The only thing the narcissist is “concerned” about is that you’re not buying their bull-shit and you’re starting to talk. Exposure is a HUGE CONCERN to the narcissist.  
We ACoNs are a smart lot, so we could generally predict the devious post-abuse cover-up and defence mechanism of the Ns. So again, we put-up and we shut-up. That’s all we knew. And then we escaped! Yeah. We escaped alright, but we were still held prisoner of the N’s training and brainwashing.
“God’s concentration camp” is how some have described the life of children growing up with narcissist/psychopath parents.     
So you leave the Narcissist Concentration Camp where you have been bullied, brainwashed and trained to play the Rat Game and put-up with the abuse, and other predators out there in the world lick their chops and see that they have a live one. Why do we ACoNs attract other Ns? We don’t. They’re attracted to US because we’re the only people who will put up with narcissistic abuse.
Being trained to put up with narcissistic abuse goes something like this: if you call a narcissist on their crap they will have a raging tantrum, viciously attack you, guilt you, drown you out, block all communication, deny, evade, dismiss, minimize, blame shift, project, feign victimhood and pathologize YOU. Remember, they’re perfect and above reproach, AND they always get their way. That’s what I learned in a MN family, and that’s what made me tasty N bait. I was too scared to call a narc on their crap, for if I dared to I would be threatened and intimidated into silence.
After I escaped the N family cult, other N wolves slithered into my life. There was one in particular who was really mean and abusive. When I answered the phone and heard Neil’s voice I would instantly get a stomach ache. So one day I told a normal person about this creep and he said to me, “Why don’t you say something to him as soon he becomes abusive?” I paused, and said “I don’t know. I guess I’m afraid to.” He said, “Why? What do you think will happen?” After a long pause, I said “He’ll probably get mad.” The normal guy replied, “So what if he gets mad. That’s HIS problem.”
Ding! Ding! Ding! Light bulb moment. So while we think we may be protecting ourselves by not calling the narcissist on their crap what we really are doing is protecting the tender feelings/ego of the malicious narcissist. We don’t want to upset the poor, pathetic infantile little narcissist. THAT is precisely the crux of N abuse training. The narcissists makes damn sure to keep their victims in a FOG of Fear, Obligation and Guilt. We are programmed to take good care of the narcissist at all times because they are the only ones with rights and the only ones that matter.  

So do you think it worked when I said something to Neil about his abusive treatment of me? Hells NO! He tried to intimidate me into silence with a raging narcissistic attack. He yelled, “Oh com’ on Lisette!! Give me a fucking break! Get over it!” Then he stormed out and slammed the door behind him. That was the end of that Nship.  
In the end, is it really worth it to call a narcissist on their crap? Do you really want to subject yourself to this kind of hell to make a point that the narcissist is too mentally, emotionally and morally retarded to get? Moreover, is it really worth it to have this kind of nasty creature in your life at all? The only way to keep the peace with these mutants is to forfeit your SELF and obey them, appease them and acquiesce to all their demands.
And this depraved mal-treatment by the narcissist goes so much further than the vicious attack they launch at you if you dare to stand-up to their abuse. They will have a massive hissy fit if you do anything that amounts to not treating them like they are god’s gift. Here are some real life examples:
Clancy, the toxic sack of MN shit mentioned earlier in this post asked me to attend a wedding with him, and I said sure. The morning of the wedding I woke up with what felt like the flu. I was absolutely terrified to call Clancy and tell him that I was too sick to attend the wedding, but I did and I apologized profusely. Now did Clancy say, “That’s okay. I’m sorry you’re not feeling well. I hope you get better.”??? Hells NO! Clancy screamed at me, “Jesus Lisette! How could you do this to ME?!! Com’ on!! You’re NOT that sick! Just get dressed and I’ll pick you up in a few hours!” I went on to explain that I was too ill to go anywhere. Clancy continued to rage, bark orders, bully and guilt me into compliance and then he said and I quote: “And to think I was going to be nice to you today.” Hmmm. That’s very telling, isn’t it? It tells me that everything the narcissist says and does is premeditated and done entirely for effect. There is nothing real or natural about a narcissist, including the way they treat you. They are cold, heartless, calculating machines.    

Anyway, the conversation ended with me apologizing and Clancy slamming the phone down. The next day, I called him and left a message apologizing AGAIN and saying that I hoped he had a good time at the wedding. I never heard back from Clancy. Not getting his way was simply intolerable to his majesty so it was off with my head. And this immature freak was in his 40’s!!! The creep surfaced about a year later and left me a phone message that I ignored. I guess it took that long for his highness to recover from such a blow to his ego. Unfortunately, he surfaced again and again and because this was pre-NPD knowledge, I let the evil bastard minimally back into my life, but minimum access is all it takes for a MN to harm you.
Oh, and if you get sick and cancel a date with a narcissist they will all react like Clancy. I tried to break a date once with Neil because of exhaustion from final exams, a part- time job and a massive head cold. Neil became furious and wasn’t having me back out of the evening. He didn’t give a damn if I was on my last breath, Neil simply wanted what he wanted so he bullied, guilt me and coerced me into going out with him. It didn’t matter that I was lousy company because I was about to keel over. In fact, my presence didn’t matter at all. The big fat N baby just had to get his way.   
There was another MN monster that slithered into my life. It was a new friendship so I hadn’t known this MN very long, but I knew enough to tell that Michelle was bossy, demanding, and controlling just like MN sister – go figure. Anyway, one time she invited me over for dinner. She told me that she was making spaghetti. I said, “Thanks for the invite, but I’m busy that night.” Then I laughed and told her that I had made a big batch of spaghetti the other day and had eaten it for the past 2 nights. I thought she was cool with me declining her invitation, but hells NO! A couple of days later I received a vicious narc attack from her by email. She ripped me a part from head to toe and tore a strip off me for saying that I had already eaten spaghetti! She told me not to call her unless I was calling to apologize for my behavior. Even though this was pre-NPD knowledge not only did I send her crazy, malicious, abusive email to other people that knew her, I called her up and left her a message telling her off and to never come near me. I scared the living shit out of her. And the MN predator slithered off with her tail between her legs. As far as her raging tantrum of an email went, I learned this was a common practice of malignant narcissist Michelle.   
I seriously cannot make this stuff up. These are classic temper tantrums thrown by patholgically selfish, self-centered malignant narcissists demanding to get their way. And not only do you have no right to call a narcissist on their crap, break a date, or decline an invitation, under no circumstances are you allowed to ask for anything back that belongs to you. Here’s one from the files on twisted MN sister. 

The bitch considers herself Royalty and she is much too grandiose to lower herself and ask to borrow something. No. Her Majesty merely tells you what she wants. She commands and demands. For example, one time she pointed at a belt I was wearing and barked, “I want to borrow that!” I just ignored her order, but I have made the mistake of bestowing the vile witch with kind offerings. Unfortunately, it took me a long time to understand that when you are gracious enough to “lend” something to a narcissist you are indeed “giving” to a narcissist. There is no lending involved because the narcissist truly feels they are honoring you by letting you “give” to them.
Once I was kind enough to lend MN sister some of my most precious DVDs and books. Because she is a shut-in freak, I wasn’t allowed to enter her home and hand them to her. No. I had to leave them on the stoop of her building. And when it was convenient for her majesty she would go outside and pick them up. Now I know MN sister is a weirdo so I’ve always felt sorry for her, and I followed her bizarre rules. Needless to say it worried me that my prized possessions were sitting on a sidewalk, and anyone could grab them, but I complied.
Malignant narcissist sister hung on to my DVDs and books for months and I was too scared to ask for them back. Just like I was too scared to break a date with Clancy. Anyway, during telephone conversations I would hint at getting my property back. I asked MN sister if she had enjoyed the DVDs. She would just side skirt the issue saying, “Yeah. Yeah.” And then change the subject. I would ask if she is done with the DVDs and she would say stuff like, “Yeah. Yeah. I guess I should give them back” And then quickly change the subject. She never once thanked me for lending her this stuff. In fact, she actually continued to make demand for other films that I had mentioned. “Get me that film” was her direct order. I didn’t comply. Over the years the bitch had taken, and stolen and claimed so many of my things as her own that I had ended-up writing off, and I had had enough. So come hell or high water, I was going to get those DVDs back.
A good five months after I lent the crazy psycho my DVDs she called me up. She was all chirpy on the phone, so I decided to take the opportunity to ask for my belongings back. I said, “I’m glad you called because I was going to call you to arrange a time to pick-up my DVDs.” Now what does the chirpy MN do? She suddenly turns pathetic! She was aghast that I had the audacity to make a direct request for my DVDs and she screamed and I quote, “Is that the only reason you were going to call me?!! To ask for your DVDs back?!! Can’t you see that my life is falling apart at the seams?!! I’m in dire straits and all you can think about is your DVDs??!!” Yup. Suddenly the psycho bitch was in dire straits. She was pulling the old poor me pity ploy to divert me from getting back what was rightfully mine. I wasn’t buying it and said, “What does that have to do with me getting my DVDs back?” She screamed, “Well maybe Lloyd should take back the movies he gave you!!” You see, a friend of MN sister had downloaded a bunch of crap movies onto to CDs and dropped them off to me as a thank you for doing him a favour. I didn’t ask for them, I didn’t even want them but they were given to me as a thank you gift. And now suddenly when I asked for my property back, MN sister was demanding that I give back a shitty gift that was given to me by someone else! You see, malignant narcissists think they own everyone in their lives, and if they own you then they own all that you have. So if Lloyd gives me a gift then that’s actually MN sister’s property. Do you get the idea of how controlling and greedy and selfish and entitled and bat-shit-crazy malignant narcissists are?
Long story short, MN sister put on every mask in the book to try and get her way. In one telephone conversation she played the pathetic victim, the business negotiator, the hard ass, the bitch, the bratty child and on and on. It truly was fascinating to see what lengths she would go to get her way and keep my property. I never backed down and she lost. That very day I went over to her place and picked-up my DVDs and books that she left outside for me in the rain. She’s a fucked-up weird hoarder so no one gets inside her lair. And here’s the kicker: this crazy bitch has made it her life work to go around conjuring-up diagnosis and pathologies of me. Once she held me hostage on the phone and when I politely tried over and over again to end the conversation to no avail, she got furious with me and said, “You sound irritated. You probably have a mood disorder. You could take medication for that.” So even denying the mighty malignant narcissist all of your undivided attention means that there is something wrong with YOU.
To wrap things up; malignant narcissists are moral imbeciles and they are not safe on any level. They are sick and twisted and evil. They are parasites and predators and the only thing they are capable of is taking and taking and causing chaos and harm. It is an exercise in futility to try and make them see the error of their ways because they are too far gone and too damn disturbed to ever get it. The solution? Get rid of them. Don’t let them near you, and if another one crosses your path scare it away. The malignant narcissist’s delusions and lies and deranged way of being in the world is their crap to live with, NOT yours, so don't take it. Leave them to it.
They will never be capable of normal, so don’t even go there. 


  1. Once again,another post describing my entire family... My Nmother and Narc sis-in-law(from dh's side) would say that I wasn't "normal." Narc mother-in-law at times implyed that my thinking wasn't normal. Then nmother tryed to pull that crap on the grandchild.

    I will always have a hard time dealing with the fact of who they are and what they've done to me and my family. They are big time loosers who only care about themselves

  2. Mon Dieu, The LAST 'thing" you want to ask from a MN is "May I PLEASE have My stuff back?" Guaranteed, you'll never see it. Show any vulnerability, emotional, practical and/or human and you've crossed the MN 'LINE.'
    They are entitled-you are shit on the bottom of their foot wear. And don't forget that. They remind you of such at their "convenience." All together now: It's all about "MEEEEEE" and you're "too sensitive," too "demanding" (to be treated as a human being.) Any problem/issue belongs to YOU.

    Otherwise known as "Blaming the victim." Here's what reality looks like IMO: We're NOT "victims." We're human beings and telling you this is how it is for us, for most of society, but since you're so damn special in YOUR perception/reality NO "Human Being" exists unless YOU give it "Life:" aka, Acknowledgement. And the only reason why you're granted such is because I'VE (the MN) "Granted" such. Only to use/abuse/denigrate your humanity.

    Good to have you back. "Delete" works for sickos who want to grab our attention.
    Tundra Woman-TW

    1. No human being exists as far as the MN is concerned unless THEY give it life... and the only reason they give it "life" is to DESTROY that life/humanity. How sick and how true! Thanks TW.

      Yep. "Delete" is my key of choice for the PD attention whores.

  3. Bless you my dear for they have sinned against you, Lisette. Wow, I thought I was angry but now I really am. Narcs are criminals pure and simple.

  4. You have described my MN mother as if you actually knew her and, to a lesser degree, my N daughter. Oh--and a string on N husbands and boyfriends that latched onto me like leeches until I finally got enough therapy to recognize and avoid them!

    Twelve years after my MNM died, I am still disentangling myself from her poisonous legacy and, at 65, I suppose this will be with me for the rest of my days.

    Good for you for recognizing it and thanks for posting. Maybe some other ACoN will see her/himself here and get a light-bulb moment or two!

  5. About 7 yrs ago, I reconnected with an ex-boyfriend from about 20 yrs ago. He had been really controlling back then which is why I broke up w/him. When we met again in 2005, I was recovering from a sexual assault and he was recovering from a bout w/colon cancer. He led me to believe that he turned his life around after his "brush with death." Needless to say, I had been a basket case the past year. I grabbed on to him like a life raft not knowing that the raft was carrying me to an island full of cannibals.

    He acted very supportive at first. Emotionally, I was at total rock-bottom and became very dependent on him. Over time, it was very apparent that he had not only not changed, he was worse. People ask me why I didn't leave & my only explanation is that I had regressed to an emotional state very similar to an abused child who protects and clings to his abuser. It sounds sick, I know.

    Anyway, it was 6 months of pure hell. He tried to break me every way he could & even admitted towards the end that he had done this on purpose-that he found me in a vulnerable state & wanted to destroy me.

    It ended when one rainy night he picked me up, took me to his house, and essentially sexually assaulted me, knowing what had happened less than a yr before. He then took me and dumped me in a grocery store parking-lot, in my pajamas at 2am in the pouring rain. Before he drove off, he proceeded to tell me that I was fat, I was crazy, and that the reason I was not married was because I was so crazy & pathetic that no man would ever want me. He then said in this extremely sarcastic voice, "You're not gonna go kill yourself are you?" He then spit at me & drove off. All of this less than a yr after I was sexually assaulted by a stranger. Unbelievable!!!

    1. "an emotional state very similar to an abused child who protects and clings to his abuser." You just described Stockholm syndrome. That twisted pervert isn't even human, from what you described he doesn't qualify. Dealing with these monsters there is a psychological trap to be aware of that i'm sure you understand. There is a tendency of the mind to form the belief that this event happened because of some sort of defect or weakness in the person/victim. The truth is there is a big difference between being weak and being vulnerably.I can say for certain your not a weak person, but like every real human on this planet we are vulnerable especially after being traumatized in the past. Take care.

    2. Yes! Anonymous, you make a damn good point. There is a difference between being weak and being vulnerable. Those despicable narcs hone in on vulnerabilities (whatever they may be) and then go in for the kill. They are predators and they target people who they think are easy prey and have something that they can exploit. It's not about any weakness or defect in the person/victim AT ALL. I consider myself a very strong person, but I was targeted by narcs galore because they sniffed out the fact that I have no family and no one looking out for me and protecting me... and this makes me vulnerable no matter how tough I am.

      In the case of Clancy - the sick fuck that I wrote about in the post - he has a history of targeting and abusing vulnerable women, but women who are well connected in his social circle and business world, he treats like gold. In other words, anyone who could spread the word about what a piece of shit he is, he doesn't mess with. This is common with all narcs. They pick and choose their prey (to abuse) based on vulnerablity and the ability to get away with their crimes. A predator ALWAYS needs prey. And again, in the case of that sick fuck Clancy, the vile narcs even abuse you for the very reason they target you. For example, Clancy targeted me because I have no family watching over me, but he would use this to insult me. He said, and I quote: "You know Lisette, people like you... people without families... well, they aren't as grounded as other people." He BLATANTLY attacked me in my soft spot - family, or lack there of. So typical of abusers and one of the reddest of red flags.

      You can be as strong and as smart as they come, but if you have been traumatized in your life you will be targeted by predators because they can sniff this out. Also, if you are isolated in any way narcs will see you as easy prey. We must always watch our backs.

      @ Anonymous... "He tried to break me every way he could & even admitted towards the end that he had done this on purpose-that he found me in a vulnerable state & wanted to destroy me."

      Everything these predators do is pre-meditated. From hunting down their target, to selecting their target and the way they treat their target on a minute to minute, hour to hour, day to day basis. Narcs don't have relationships, they TAKE HOSTAGES. They are cold, calculating predators. Their goal is to maintain control over another by breaking them mentally and emotionally. I think the fact that these scumbags admit to this, is just a way for them to show who's in control.

      Narcs are fucking terrorist, and they all deserve a good plegm ball right between their eyes... that and exposure.

      Drop dead Clancy D, and all you other sick fucking narcs!

    3. You created a trauma bond with him and quite honestly I wouldn't be surprised if this was his way of getting even with you for breaking up with him 20 yrs ago, they can't let go if the hate or need for revenge, if they spend all their time and energy hating you they can hide the fact that the person they truly hate is themselves.

  6. Thanks for the replies! BTW, I'm so glad I found this site. It is one of the most comprehensive, tell-it-like-it is websites about narcs. You are very sensitive towards what the victims go through and you don't try to sugar-coat or make excuses for the narcs being the way the are. I've learned it's a waste of time to delve into the "whys." Now when I meet a potential narc, I run like hell.

    Besides, the horrible relationship w/my ex, I encountered several predatory-type people for about 2yrs after my sexual assault. I think it is very similar to a wild-animal stalking his prey-they have an uncanny ability to sniff out the weakest in the herd. That's not to say that I am a weak person but that when a someone is going through a major life trauma, which we all do at one time or another, our normal defenses tend to be somewhat disabled. I've had other dating experiences with various types of narcs-just not as severe as this one. I've always had a kind, compassionate nature which I think attracts these types.

    The funny thing about my ex is that on the surface(his facade), he comes across as this goofy, yet lovable roguish, rebel-type who seems like he is unaware of how he acts. I think this is how he gets away with things. People were always shaking their heads & saying things like, "That crazy Al, what's he up to now?" They excuse his behaviour & then say things like, "I know he is a little crazy but he is so loyal to his friends & etc., etc." They(his family & friends) never believed that he was that bad. His brilliant facade is one of the reasons I was so shocked at the end when he admitted to me that he had done all this on purpose-that he had tried to destroy me. I remember right after he said that, he had this look on his face very similar to what you described under one of your other topics-that orgasmic look of pleasure a narc gets when they score a "hit" on their victims.

    I had PTSD for awhile, ended up being hospitalized, and had to see a psychiatrist who correctly told me my ex was probably narcissistic/sociopathic. Funny thing is he still calls me about 2x a yr and tells me things like, "I should have never left you. We should have gotten married. You are the nicest, most beautiful person I've ever met......yada, yada, yada." This is coming from the same man who told me I was fat, lazy, crazy and that "All women are whores who deserved to be slapped in the face by a big, fat, juicy C@#k." In reality, HE is well over 300 pounds, hasn't worked in almost 10 yrs, & lays on the couch all day long watching Sanford & Son re-runs & stuffing his face with pizza & Doritos. Talk about a perfect example of projection.

  7. Lisette,

    You mentioned that he treated the women in his social circle & at work like gold. My ex narc was the same way. He used to exploit this & would insinuate that if I was as strong, attractive, and together like all those other women, then he wouldn't have to treat me so bad. Did your's do the same? I think this is one way they mentally & emotionally isolate you to make you feel that everyone else is normal & that you are the crazy one.

  8. I crap canned a MN friend 2 years ago. It still bugs me that I am mad at MYSELF for being dumb enough to get in a friendship with her. She has been out of my life as long as she was IN it, and I am still disappointed with myself for not listening to my instincts. I had all the typical "she is too good to be true" thoughts.

    Except, for the end, the end when I realized she was a MN. The turning moment was when I told her "you have done some things that have hurt me..." and her response was not, "I am so sorry",but, "Friends hurt each other all the time. It is human nature to hurt one another."

    WOW. Drove the nail home for me. I was supposed to be hurt. It was "normal" for her to hurt people. She saw nothing wrong with it and "I" was over reacting.

    Someday I will get over the fact that I am disappointed in myself for allowing her to reign in my life for a couple of years.

    My husband is an would think I would know.

  9. You'd think we would all know better. The truth is we do, but we ignore our instincts. And if you've been raised by narcs then you've been trained NOT to trust yourself, your perceptions, your gut feelings. With every narc I've known there were red flags that I saw loud and clear but chose to ignore because I thought, nah... they didn't do that on purpose... they didn't mean that... they would never do that. Ha! Oh-yes-they-did! I've been pissed at myself for being too trusting, and giving these cretins the benefit of the doubt. In other words, I've been mad at myself for being a decent human being. And THAT'S precisely what these narcs rely on to get away with their crimes: human decency. Our common belief that most people are good and mean well. Double HA!!! Some people are just rotten to the core and don't have a decent bone in their body.

    I've also known narcs that I nipped in the bud right away and got rid of - no time wasted. And I had no risidual anger from those narc experiences because I trusted myself and took action. Thing is, those narcs I got rid of pronto had very obvious bad behaviour. They weren't very slick. It's the subtly abusive narcs that are really dangerous because they are like a drip drop of poison wearing down a person mentally and emotionally.

    1. The not trusting your instincts is so true: Both of my parents are always saying 'you only remember the bad things!' Well, I would A. Remember the good things if their were good things to remember,i.e. spending time with your daughter, not critizing every single move (literally everything I did from folding a napkin, hanging laundry, the shapes of my piles of grass I had raked, everything.) B. I remember the handful of times we did something together where I was not yelled at. I believe people develop schizoidal type personalities if they don't persist in believing themselves against their Narc' parents lies. My parents aways say two different things at once, they say something then do the opposite, they consistently lie. I am sane because I left my house at 15 ( I finished school, and work in a professional degree.) You have to reach deep inside you to know that what you believe in is true, even though you may not realize exactly or believe fully that you aren't the one at fault, it will come with time and self healing.

  10. So true. I get pissed that I didn't say anything to these narcs when I should have called them out. I had one narc in my home that I didn't even know,rage at me about something. Who freaking does that unless you are a piece of sh** narc.... At times I find my mind still wants to revert back to the brainwashing that narc parents did. Just recently I told my dh that if someone comes at me in a wrong way(narc or not), watch out. They are going to get a tongue lashing.I'm tired of these low lifes thinking that people are just their dumping gound.

  11. I am so thankful that I found this web site when I did. I am just finding out that my parents are both N's. My father is very sick and put his children through extreme psychological, verbal and physical abuse. I don't know why it took me this long to realize that they were both n's, I guess that I just never looked, I always assumed that he was a psychopath.
    It is true your statement about the sadism and cruelty. When I was 14 yrs old I had all of my wisdom teeth extracted. The dentist did a poor job and I had severe hemorrahging, I was at home and it was late at night, I was exhausted and I woke up, I had swallowed so much blood that I went to the bathroom because I was ill. I threw up blood, got up, and ended up passing out. I woke up to find my mother screaming for my father to come help. I remember him from the bed telling my mother to forget 'about it' and to go to bed that 'Your daughter was exaggerating.'
    That incident haunts me. The sad thing is is that was how I was treated every single day of my life and it takes an 'incident' to really realize the depth of his hatred etc. I live far away from them now, I went home to visit and when I left my father's final words were if I didn't lose weight that I would never see him again. While he said this he had a smirk on his face, he was actually loving to me upset. My husband was horrified, horrified that a parent could be like this to their own child.
    We aren't imagining their joy in inflicting pain. It is true.

  12. Can't afford to have that. I inspect before applying.

  13. "The learned /Eolists+° maintain the original cause of all things to be wind, from which principle this whole universe was at first produced and into which it must at last be resolved; that the same breath which had kindled and blew up the flame of nature, should one day blow it out." (Jonahtan Swift, "A Tale of a Tub")

  14. I just want to thank you and everyone else who is writing this. The MN I am associated with has beaten me down so far that he has me thinking I am the crazy one. The stories you tell sound like my stories. Imagine being made to feel so bad about not being able to keep a date with this MN that he thtreatens you and accuses you of having a date with someone else when in fact when you are violently ill with a stomach virus where leaving the bathroom is not even an option and he knows for a fact that you are really sick. So, you get dressed and drive 30 mins to his house, the one he threw you out of and are still paying half the rent on, so that he can belittle and abuse you some more, in between your trips to the bathroom to be sick...and does he ONCE offer to get you anything for your upset stomach or to comfort you. HELL NO!! You are inconveniencing him by being sick. He goes into a rant and you leave and drive back to your father's where you are staying now because otherwise you would be homeless because you have no money because you are paying rent and utilities on the place he tossed you out of. Like you say above, you can't make this stuff up!

  15. These monsters require one of five things in order to suck you in and win you over. I have learned this from your wonderful web site. Don't ever let any of them happen: Proximity, intimacy, guilt, complacency (their fake kindness), or second-guessing yourself. Am I leaving any out? Please feel free to add to the list. THANK YOU for your web site!!!

    1. They cannot take relationships at a slow pace. When you first meet them,they want to have an instant bond with you...even when you have no interest in them!

    2. yes. they make you think you are the most wonderful thing to ever happen to them and that you are so compatible and "connected" then suddenly you are the worst person in the world. You wonder what the heck happened. They are liars. I am trying desperately to get over this but it is almost like being co-dependent. They cannot be alone ever! They will jump to someone else before your side of the bed is even cold. Wow!

    3. Yeah isn't that the truth.

    4. Anonymous 28 May 2012,

      During the "luring" phase, narcs/psychopaths/PDs are always "on" and pushing for an instant bond. They need to work you over FAST because it is very difficult for them to maintain their mask of sanity for long. By nature, these freaks are really lazy and don't want to invest too much time or energy in the game. So once they have created a bond, which is nothing more than a dominance bond, then the cracks in their mask begin to show, or the mask crashes and falls to the ground.

      We should always be wary of ANYONE who wants an instant attachment. Normal people aren't hiding behind a false self so they take time to get to know you, and you them. But the pathologicals have a hell of a lot to hide so they work FAST to getcha hooked (on their "wonderful" false image) before you see them for the danagerous, parasitic, life sucking creatures that they really are.

      Anonymous May 29 2012,

      No. They can't stand being alone. They are terrified of what may surface to their conscious if they have a single solitary moment to reflect. They refuse to look inward and instead seek outward means of validation for their vile false self.

      I think the best punishment for these monsters is SOLITARY CONFINEMENT. Take away their supply (people) and their favorite activities: predation and parasitism, as well as other diversions that numb them from the hard truth of who they are like: workaholism, alcoholism, drug use, TV addiction, porn, manic activity etc. And, what are they left with? Their sad, sorry non-selves.

      They don't want to be alone with themselves for a second, and who can blame them. Without their masks they make lousy company, are total party killers, and could clear a room in a millisecond... not to mention the damage and destruction they cause to others and their lives.

  16. Yes, they beat you down emotionaly. People who have never been through this don't get it... Society and the psycho babble crap tells you that you "allowed" it and that you should be over it within a couple of months. When you grow up in a nfoo, that's all you know because you have been brainwashed. Being the scapegoat, you come to believe that they are treating you this way because you deserve it. That's just one way they mess with your head.

    Screw you to anybody who thinks that I allowed this!! You obviously refuse to hold the perp accountable for their evil and abusive actions. Those people who believe this are screwed up in the head and need to get over themselves.

    1. I am with you. They beat you down until you don't even know how to exist without the abuse. And no you don't allow it, it just happens. You want them to be the person they were in the beginning when they were faking who they were and you keep hoping that person will surface again. If you have never been held hostage by one of these evil people you just can't understand. Anybody ever heard of the Stockholm Syndrome? That applies here and when you finally escape, believe me you definitely have PTSD (post traumatice stress disorder). I was afraid to go outside for about 2 months after I got away for fear he would see me and either do something or contact me and ask me how dare I be outside without his permission. NO I am not joking.

  17. Right. We do NOT allow it. They are sneaky, lying, false-faced, evil creatures. We do not SEE it, because their masks hide who they are SO well sometimes.

    1. Yup, even "we" do not see it because their masks hide so well who they really are sometimes. Well said. "We" the experts - as far as I'm concerned - can get conned and conned again. From my experience, the MN's that I know personally - say, "family" - I'm aware of their methods ... But, god help me if some smooth operator with a slick mask tries to pull one over on me. They don't wear cow-bells. Even the leading scientists in the field get fooled... but not for long. Just beware and never ignore any red flags as minor as they seem to be. Also, try and separate your heart from your mind. The heart wants what the heart wants... the mind knows what it knows. Knowledge is power.

  18. I had MN parents - both now dead - a good move on their parts because neither would have survived the rage I could have unleashed on them when I 'woke up' to the depth of neglect and emotional/psychological abuse they subjected me to.

    What was really tricksy, is that my mother was diagnosed with Manic Depression a few years before I was born - and that became her 'hall pass' for the Malignant Narcissism that was the foundation of her character. My mother had five siblings and it was only after talking to my cousins, that we managed to clear away the FOG and understand that the whole family was FUBAR.

    What I do know, is that if you are in the orbit of a MN family, you have a lot of work to do with getting rid of the stink in your own psyche; the conditioning you received to respond in the same way. All the traits that got dumped into you before you went to school. Understanding the stages of child development is one way to restore your crushed sensitivities, and it takes time.

    My mother totally hood-winked everyone, including a psychiatrist she saw once a month for close to 20 years. I met him once and he struck me as a professional enabler. You need to be aware that Malignant Narcissists have access to support networks that their supply sources never do. Especially when they have a 'hall pass' masquerading as a medical diagnosis, which enables them to behave with impunity and to avoid moral agency. The catch-cry is "they don't mean what they say", "they don't know what they're doing".

    Knowledge is not power. It's just a bunch of information that you've
    accumulated. It is just the sum total of ignorance. The mind knows what it has been conditioned to know and that conditioning starts before a child has learned to speak.

    You want to recover from being innoculated by a Malignant Narcissist? Then be prepared to pull out all your 'wiring', examine all your beliefs, where they came from, who gave them to you, how you worship them and maintain them, and what triggers strong emotional responses in you. Being around malignant narcissists is not for sissies. Taking them on; calling them on their crap takes skill.

    New Age foo foo such as "You chose this experience to evolve your soul" is narcissist-enabling. No child chooses to be abused, to have their psyche distorted and poisoned. EVER. Every adult, however, has the choice to respond cruelly or compassionately. A simple analogy: when you see a snail on the footpath. Do you squash it or do you pick it up and remove it out of harm's way? Having done that, do you then take glee in the misfortune of some celebrity who is being dissected by the media? That is the thin edge of malignant narcissism: it's a global stain in all human societies. Each culture invents philosophies to rationalise it and religions to give it moral authority.

    You kid yourselves if you think psychology is going to kill off this Golden Goose.


  19. I just found your blog and have already posted a comment about another of your posts.

    My mother died when I was 6 and my grandmother, whom I have long known as a tyrant, insisted she raise my siblings and I. Her temper tantrums include turning tables over when she lost while playing card games. I have realized that one brother and my sister are narcissists, but I just had the realization that grandma was also.

    I was "locked out" while staying with extended family at a home town event, and had to sleep in the car. One cousin told me I had "no right" to be upset. I get it. Thanks! I had no rights as a child for anything. I only had duty to run after others, to cook, clean, launder, fetch, while others sat on their ever criticizing asses. Yes, I was scapegoat #1.

    I attended a small college, and the next year, my sister joins the same college. She was so jealous of me having a boyfriend and being on the dean's list. The night of college prom, and she has no date, she takes a bunch of aspirin and slits her wrists. I get a call and an ambulance had been called. Why? Jealousy! But, don't tell anyone else.

    I am no longer in communication with most of these narcissists, and they have all been called on their crap by me, but I think narcissists are a nosy lot. They have to snoop to know what to be critical of, or jealous of.

    So glad I found your blog, but I want to copy and paste ALL of it! Thank you, thank you for your wisdom, although, I know it came with much pain.

  20. @Rain-in-the-Face1 July 2012 16:18
    "You want to recover from being innoculated by a Malignant Narcissist? Then be prepared to pull out all your 'wiring', examine all your beliefs, where they came from, who gave them to you, how you worship them and maintain them, and what triggers strong emotional responses in you. Being around malignant narcissists is not for sissies. Taking them on; calling them on their crap takes skill."

    Very powerful and deep posts... It's also quite discouraging for someone like myself who is the lone survivor of my family. With noone to have your back. It's just me and God (which I prefer to have over the NARCs anytime). It's just really terrifying at times.

  21. Anonymous of 2 July 2012. I am the lone survivor of my family and it is terrifying when you feel that no-one has your back: that is a terrifying illusion for you have always had you. Many people have wishbones; they wish things had been different, better, that these people were nicer. That is a wishbone - hook two pinkie fingers around the edge and you can snap it in half. You have to call yourself on your own crap! And having made the call, have a good laugh with the God of your understanding.

    When nobody has your back, there is also nobody to stick a knife in your back.

    You have always had you. Trust yourself, really trust yourself, that when a clusterfuck comes your way: you will come through for yourself.

    There are good and kind people in this world. Some people are lucky to be related to those people.

  22. "It's also quite discouraging for someone like myself who is the lone survivor of my family." The psychological ramifications to this kind of situation can be very difficult. I don't know what others have gone through but I was plagued with survivors guilt and still have panic knowing there isn't anyone one left.

  23. Your description of the MN has finally slapped me over the head and given me permission to realize it is not me. And I have read every current book on npd. When I feel like I am slipping--I will read your blog post again and again to keep me in check. I am a doctoral level psychologist btw--nobody is immune for falling prey to these sick people. I fell hook, line and sinker and have been trying to recover for a year. Your post has helped tremendously! Thanks.

  24. Reading your blog is therapeutic for me.
    I was oblivious of the dark, warped and evil world of narcissists until a year ago when I encountered and suffered at the hands of a few very prolific Ns. They are powerful and influential in society and are using their powers to continually attack me, sometimes on a daily basis.
    Yes, their attacks are covert and subtle and so I'm unable to do anything but silently suffer. They have influenced my friends and acquaintances as well and am forced to isolate myself. But I'm way stronger than I was before. Even if the world does not support me, I know that I'm right in thinking the way I do and believing in what I do.

    When I read your blog I feel like I'm reading my story. It is heartening to know that there are others out there like me who can relate to my pain. Even though my family wants to support me, they fail to understand that the attack is happening, since it is not obvious in nature. It is difficult for people who have not had such an experience to fully understand a victim's pain.
    Emotional Abuse does not leave behind visible scars and that's probably the most difficult part that a victim/survivor has to deal with.

    I'm so glad to have found your blog, it is just very reassuring to know more about similar experiences from other survivors.

    Together we shall, in mind, body and spirit, fight the forces of evil.

    1. The fact that you mention how influential on the community the Ns in your life are really struck a chord with me. Since Ns are so power hungry, and live to manipulate the world at large, its no wonder that most of our leaders are evil, and fall into the N trap as well.

      They have a vested interest in keeping things unequal, and one way to do that is to continually put you down in subtle ways so you will be unaware, but over time, beaten down just the same. Someone put it like this, "one water drop doesnt do anything to a rock, but a million water drops consistently will over time round and wither the rock down".. Thats how I feel about the Ns in my life.

      I too have had to escape, and isolate myself, but this isnt ALL bad. You regroup, you gain clarity and distance, and hopefully your isolation is short lived. I know I've had to do this a pinnacle points in my life.

      Pinnacle is the key world, because Ns dont like it when we grow, change, etc. We then become a threat to them. In this sense, isolation is actually better, until we can regroup and find others that share what we beleive.

  25. Catherine Geudens15 August 2012 at 13:28

    Daily physical beatings, manipulations, verbal violence, pushing to suicide, drama's, these parents commit soul-murder on their children. My brother, the golden child, became a violent psycho and I escaped in order to save my life. And nobody really believes you, because they are very calculated and play perfect, putting on their mask, using everybody they can for their game.

    1. Lisette,

      I admire you for your courage and for inspiring others to be courageous.
      Narcs are creeps without a conscience. They fail to acknowledge and respect an individual's basic rights and personal space.

      Like, whatever goes on in a person's home is his or her own business. If the person or the family is not doing anything totally unacceptable then it's between the people living in that house and should be kept that way. Any unrest in the family may actually be caused due to the narcs constant prying and preying. If the family seeks intervention they will surely ask someone appropriate. Else, like we learned in kindergarten, one must mind their manners and stay out of other people's homes and lives.

      All human beings may at times be curious, envious and even cross the line once in a while, but narcs always provide an extreme, exaggerated, unreasonable and over-the-top reaction to any life situation.

      Using one's influence to plant monitoring devices in another person's home under false pretenses and then using their personal life and goings on to attack and harass them is in violation of all kinds of human rights. Not that narcs care if they violate the rights of others, but a violation is still a violation.

      No matter who the narcs are, they should stay out of another person's home! They are sick peeping toms, voyeurs, cyber- harassers and basically really really sick and insecure people using their clout and influence to stoop to the lowest of low levels to get back at somebody who probably didn't even do anything to them in the first place. If they introspect, they'll find that their hatred is unreasonable and their envy self-generated and in the long run it will all prove to be self-mutilating.

      They may have all the power in the world but they have absolutely no shame or a conscience and everyone knows that. People may not say it to their face because they fear the narcs might do something nasty to them but they are known to be mean and devious followers of an evil culture, self- serving in their attitude towards all.

      In the end they should know that their war is worthless. The victim knows he/she cannot and does not want to win.

  26. This describes my sister EXACTLY. My grandmother once predicted that my sister would "cause trouble" and she was right. Dealing with my sister's constant crap is exhausting and painful. The worst part is that she has 2 boys and her behavior is affecting them. My parents and I love them dearly and do our best to protect them, but I worry that we aren't doing enough.

    As an aside, I used to be in love with a narcissistic man and he was a major reason I had a mental breakdown. A few weeks after my release from the hospital, he was out of my life. It was the best thing I ever did.

  27. Kudos and more power to you!
    Ns are blinded by their power and are therefore arrogant. They may dismiss karma but karma rules over all and will not dismiss them.

    Time is the avenger and in time justice will be served.

    1. I don't believe in karma or in any magical forms of justice. Most evil people don't get what's coming to them.

    2. Only occasionally: my narc husband took his girlfriend to the same place we spent our honeymoon and made sure I knew they were going (she was a narc too). While they were there, he broke his neck, was paralysed from the neck down, and spent the next 16 months spewing venom (particularly at me) as if it was all my fault. Happily, he drank weedkiller through a straw and killed himself. I didn't supply it though I think I know who did. If I was a hypocrite I would say how sorry I was about his tragedy. I'm not sorry - and if anyone knew the day to day reality of my hell-on-earth life with him, they wouldn't feel sorry either (if they are as sane as you are). Karma? I don't know. Maybe. But as you say - most don't get what's coming to them. My evil narc mother's spite and malice turned to gallstones, and her hatred turned into gangrene in her feet (which killed her). I think they both got what they deserved, coincidental or not. They were monsters.

    3. Good! I'm glad they got what they deserved. They both died from poisons in their system, and that is very fitting for these monsters. Wouldn't it be nice if that happened to all narcs? Their toxic nature turned on them and they died from their own poison.

      Anonymous, thank you for sharing this. I appreciate your honesty.

  28. I don't believe in Karma but I believe in the power of the chicken foot.
    One must approach the narcissist with your hand out and palm up. Let the chicken foot lay flat in the palm.
    After you have lulled him into a false sense of security plunge the foot claw end first into his eye.

    1. Now the chicken foot is some justice I can get behind.

  29. It's great that you keep an open forum here, include rebuttals, offer different perspectives and let people express themselves freely unlike the intolerant Ns, who are ready to exaggerate and incriminate victims without credible reason.
    Thanks for the humor and sprinkling of lighthearted comments in between all the serious discussions.
    Be it the chicken foot or karma, may we all get justice one way or another.

    Besides being an excellent writer, one of the other reasons why you are admired and have many readers is perhaps because you provide an encouraging and supportive platform for victims and survivors to share their pain, tragic experiences and personal views without inhibitions. Unlike the Ns, you help spread the message that individuals can agree to disagree and lead civil lives without destroying each other over petty nonsense.

    1. Anonymous,
      Thanks for the positive feedback.

      "Chicken foot or karma, may we all get justice one way or another."

      Yes! And if chicken foot or karma means people getting mad as hell, not taking it anymore, and kicking the narcissist to the curb, then so be it. It's a start. Not allowing narcissists to have access to us, is a start.

  30. I just found your blog last night and am reading up on it. I was googling MN. My ex is your description of a MN. I had suffered from his abuse for so many years and am now fighting back with support from a wonderful husband. I met my ex in a cult of all places! His whole family are MN. My ex MIL took great pride that she is just like Marie from Everybody loves Raymond! I'm in a bitter custody battle right now. Though we have joint custody, he has residential custody of our son. Long story short, he had an attorney and I didn't and nevermind the twisted lies of events. I do take some of the blame though. He uses our son as a pawn and to hurt me. I see my son going down his path and I'm trying to stop it before it is too late. In less than 48 hr my son is going to have major surgery on his hip. Dumbass is doing his best to take my rights from me. I will be fighting back. Both my husband and I are sick of his twisted lies and his dictorship. I am taking back my life. He will no longer abuse me, manipulate me and beat me down. I have to keep telling myself that. I just praying that the guardian ad litem for my son will see thru dumbass's bullshit! And the judge. Thank you for your blog. It helps that I'm not alone!

    1. Anon,
      Cults seem to be one of those closed environments that attract MNs. I'm glad you got rid of the dumbass and are fighting back. It's good to hear that you have the support of a wonderful husband. I hope your son is okay, and that he doesn't succumb to his MN father's influence. I'm sure you'll do what you need to, to make sure that doesn't happen.

  31. God bless your heart for this blog.
    It's taken me 41yrs to realize my mother is a narcissist. And unfortunately I've seen some narc traits in myself but nothing to the cruel phony exterior of my mothers.
    Narcissism is definitely a scalable disorder and some people are very low on the scale while the dangerous predators are higher up.
    What really rang true for me is that I've always felt my Mother derived pleasure from watching me suffer. But ironically, was always "helping" the less fortunate and letting you know how great she was for offering her time to the downtrodden.
    Another similarity was that she can never ask for something but always demands it. And if she think you'll say no, she won't bother asking. God forbid that it looks like you're doing favour for her. Only she can perform favours.
    Anyway, thanks for putting your story out there for the rest of us. It's good to know that I'm not crazy.

    1. You're welcome innertrain. Yes, these "Mothers" feed off our pain, and then they cloak themselves in the role of "helper" to keep others off their scent. Of course, we know who and what they are and just want to point and shout, "But the Emperor is wearing no clothes!" Commands and demands are hallmark N behavior. They are much to above us mere mortals to "ask" for anything. No, you're not crazy but they sure are.

  32. Anyone out there could advise me how to play an evil MN ... I have just seen the light that I am a codependent in a toxic relationship with a Mn woman and of course have spent these last two weeks reading everything I can about how the MN mind works and how I was a groomed victim for the last 7 years.

    Now she has moved out for what she calls a trial time apart ... and left me with two young children as I refused to let her take them with her ... but she has just dropped below the surface to regroup and come back with a world of pain and bile ... so she has gone quiet whilst I have played the new role of me not saying anything that she can twist and distort for her own ends. Like a great white shark that has ripped your leg off and slipped back beneath the water into the darkness but you know she is circling beneath you and will be back for more ...

    I am now not sure how to play the next part of the game for her namely the custody of the children. Do I call her bluff and say you have them which is what she claims she wants, namely just to spite me as she knows I love them so much. This approach hinges on the fact that she has a built up a very successful business which she gladly spends seven days a week involved in and so has no time at all for the children. Surely the last thing she wants is two young children in her custody as she cant stand to be alone with them for more than 2 hours max? But this premis is based on logic and that last thing she is is logical.

    But somehow I don't believe she would entertain allowing me to have them, nuture them and protect them. She will unleash hell itself when she realises that I have a found a backbone and will not allow her back into my life.

    Any suggestions by anyone who has been in this position would be gratefully received.

    1. It's all about WINNING to the N so even if she doesn't want the children, getting custody of them means she wins. Unless or course, you make it clear you do not want them, and then she might force them on you. It's the reverse psychology thing. You can never let a N know how much you know or what you're thinking. In some ways - if you can swing it - you need to let her believe she is making all the decisions and you are complying. I don't have any experience in fighting for custody of children with a MN so I'm hoping someone with some insight on this will chime in.

  33. Anon from 11 March 15:52: This is primarily an ACoN site, but here's a few ideas-
    -Get an attorney PRONTO.
    -Take a good read at "Shrink4Men" a Blog/Forum by Dr. Tara Parmateer<sp? and check out the links at her site as well. There's a ton of great stuff for men at her site and plenty have been in your position.
    I hope you are *not* entertaining any thoughts of "reconciliation" to enter your mind. EVER. One does not "play an evil MN:" You get out and stay OUT. Good luck.

  34. It is time that we call the Narc what it truly is a soulless, none human with not one human trait.if it has no human qualities can it truly be called a human simply because it looks human. A Narcissist is nothing more that a Demon in human Form.